[NYC] MoMA new addition [Archive]

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jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:04

Well, this is another foto trip I made on x-mas, this time in NY, visiting the New MoMA by Yoshio Tanaguchi, pretty nice building, if you go dont miss the store, lot of cool design stuff to buy, since I was newly wed, i bought some things for my house.

Anyhoo, into the thread:

http://www.moma.org/

Directions:

The Museum of Modern Art
(212) 708-9400
11 West 53 Street, between Fifth and Sixth avenues
New York, NY 10019-5497

Museum Hours
Saturday 10:30 a.m.–5:30 p.m.
Sunday 10:30 a.m.–5:30 p.m.
Monday 10:30 a.m.–5:30 p.m.
Tuesday closed
Wednesday 10:30 a.m.–5:30 p.m.
Thursday 10:30 a.m.–5:30 p.m.
Friday 10:30 a.m.–8:00 p.m.

Closed on Christmas day and Thanksgiving day

ickets are 20$ i think, and it grants you access to the PS1 also, theres a free day, but it was on the evening so you wont be able to take nice exterior pictures.

Pictures:

01
This in 54 St, the back of the MoMA, behind that wall is the SCULTURE GARDEN

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:04

02
Same, from across

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:05

03
Same, but the other direction

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:06

04
Same but close and looking up

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:07

05
Ok, now we're on 53 ST, this aint hte MoMA, but the Folk Art Museum, it happens to be next to the MoMA

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:07

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:08

07
Past the entrance, the lobby, to the left is the entrance to the Sculture Garden

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:08

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:09

09
Exit to the Garden

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:10

10
Detail

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:11

11
This is outside in the SCULTURE GARDEN, all the following pictures are taken in here, looking in various directions, Check those frames that let you see through

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:11

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:12

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:12

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:13

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:13

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:14

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:14

18
Detail of marble slab, to drain the water

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:15

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:16

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:16

21
above the garden, The apartments in front have compmlain to the museum for the lack of privacy, al the ppl taking pictures and stuff.

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:17

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:17

23
Top floor, sun screens

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:27

24
Balcony on the last floor, the railings are in glass, as you get closer to it, is pretty scary, and look down you kinda get dizzy for a sec.

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:28

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:29

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:33

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:35

28
main lobby space

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:36

29
main lobby space (picture a panoramic with the above image)

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:37

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:37

jedisalf

11-05-2006, 15:38

jparchitectus

11-05-2006, 15:58

Thanks for sharing. Well posted. I always enjoy how different people view the same project. I am here in NY and have yet to go to the new MOMA. Saturdays and Sundays are an aweful time to go to the museum. They are usually so packed it is unbearable.

imasayer

11-05-2006, 16:37

Thanks for posting this, you got some views I have not seen yet.

I have mixed feelings about this building. I like how sleek and clean it is, but it also feels a bit soulless. Like it doesn't matter that is it MOMA or that it is in New York. I don't know, just don't love it. I have not been inside though, last time I was in New York it was under construction. The exterior was about 95% though.

Anyone else feel this way?

SWANK-E

11-05-2006, 16:48

wizum

11-05-2006, 16:59

By chance jedisalf do you have an aerial photo or site plan that gives the general layout of the building? I guess since this is new that it wouldn't show up in GE? but can you, or Primo :), post the kmz location file for this project... I think, at first glance I have to agree with imasayer on the coldness on the building, and with Swank-E on the missed oportunity... Its this type of "modern" type of building that I think turns people off to modern design...

trogers

11-05-2006, 17:20

for the expense, IMO, this building doesn't do anything for me...I'd rather see the Folk Art Museum than the MOMA. Worth posting, though, just for reference of opinion...

jparchitectus

11-05-2006, 18:52

thanks for posting this and posting it so well

unfortunately i feel this is an expensive non-descript building... what an opportunity lost. what's with those square openings in the facade? i keep thinking it's meant to frame something, but i really can't imagine it framing anything at all apart from some form-making justifications

See i wasn't sure if that was the project or his photos. I got the same impression, but couldn't decide if it was the way it was shot or the actual building.

WilsonMetry

11-05-2006, 19:18

Very well photographed. Thanks so much jedisalf.

Swanke - I see your point about the square openings in the facade. They dont frame anything much.

But the interior windows/relights work much better. Take a look at posts 19 and 31. In the 19 you get a glimpse of the stairs way in the back. And I love the framed Matisse in 31.

Overall, I like the restraint of the building. Seems to fit the modern air of the art. Compliments each other well. Sometimes it is what we dont see.

I dont like the impenetrable wall at the sidewalk. I think it would be much better to borrow the energy from the street scape since there is no way the court yard is going to be a tranquil sculpture garden anyway.

primocordara

11-05-2006, 20:14

hey Scott, here it is, as requested, ... just type MOMA, NY, USA in GE ;)

?eter

11-05-2006, 21:12

I was at MoMA in December 2004, a week after the re-opening, when the new extension was still new and shiny. Jedisalf's excellent photos are far more extensive than mine, but I have one or two things to add:
the lobby in front of the architecture collection- some Gaudi, Herzog and de Meuron, Frank Lloyd Wright etc..

?eter

11-05-2006, 21:13

And this is not a a sculpture-
The rooflight was leaking :wondering ... one week after the building opened.

cacapis

11-05-2006, 21:15

Herzog and de Meuron weren't there when I visited april 2005

Hotrats

11-05-2006, 21:16

they were too busy taking JP out for lunch. :D

cacapis

11-05-2006, 21:20

and spilling stuff on his lap. There shoud be a picture of that in this forum!!

cacapis

11-05-2006, 21:21

And this is not a a sculpture-
The rooflight was leaking :wondering ... one week after the building opened.
Don't be fooled!! That's art!!!!:bang head

jparchitectus

11-05-2006, 21:29

they were too busy taking JP out for lunch. :D

Just when I thought no one listened :D

jparchitectus

11-05-2006, 21:30

Don't be fooled!! That's art!!!!:bang head

I was going to say it isn't such a bad piece :cool:

?eter

11-05-2006, 21:32

finally, a link to a mystery object game (http://www.pushpullbar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1924) featuring the MoMA sculpture garden, and a long exposure photograph- 30 months, to be exact. Taken while MoMA was under construction by Michael Wesely (http://www.wesely.org/) - get the exhibition catalogue at Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/redirect?link_code=ur2&tag=ropesandpoles-20&camp=1789&creative=9325&path=tg%2Fdetail%2F-%2F0870706829%2Fqid%3D1147375738%2Fsr%3D1-1%2Fref%3Dsr_1_1%3Fv%3Dglance%26s%3Dbooks">Exhibition catalogue)

BrianMyers

11-05-2006, 23:10

imasayer

11-05-2006, 23:25

This building is a perfect example of what I mentioned in another thread, does the design in this case get in the way of the function? In other words, the design is likely memorable, but some spaces seem narrow and compact, others over-sized, still others are mostly long hallways.

I have no doubt this space meets the project requirements and gets the job done. I also agree with the posts in here being critical of it and the reasons given. But I also think this is a great example where the designers tried to be modern and artistic.. created some memorable spaces... yet might have achieved a less than friendly design in terms of function because of how they stretched the concept of their design and went out of their way to create an experience (which ultimately may/may not be good either).

Brian,

I think that you are being rather ignorant in your form vs. function ideals. I don't think that anyone here would argue that function isn't important. You seem to think that they are exclusive of each other, when it appears that it is just your aesthetic bias. No one has commented on the function of this building as of yet. If you don't like modern/contemporary design that is fine, but don't tell me that it can't function as well as any other type of building. Sorry to get off topic a little, but I thought I should address it here.

To get back to this thread: Those who have visited, do you think that the museum functions well?

BrianMyers

12-05-2006, 01:30

I think that you are being rather ignorant in your form vs. function ideals. I don't think that anyone here would argue that function isn't important. You seem to think that they are exclusive of each other, when it appears that it is just your aesthetic bias. No one has commented on the function of this building as of yet. If you don't like modern/contemporary design that is fine, but don't tell me that it can't function as well as any other type of building. Sorry to get off topic a little, but I thought I should address it here.

To get back to this thread: Those who have visited, do you think that the museum functions well?

First, I would appreciate the next time you criticize an idea from me or another that you wouldn't call that idea ignorant as I wouldn't do the same to you. But to get past that, just because no one suggested it wasn't functional doesn't mean that it is.

Example: For this picture (http://www.pushpullbar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16848&stc=1&d=1147353355) would you say that there is much room during a typical week-end for a person in a wheelchair or a group of individuals touring together to walk down a hall and pause to look at pictures or art? For me it feels like a space where "traffic jams" of individuals will get stopped especially on the right side.

This hallway (http://www.pushpullbar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16850&stc=1&d=1147353427) may serve a function and perhaps may be there for more art... but if it's simply an empty hallway is it needed?

Ultimately I could argue the opposite and say perhaps the exibit space could be arranged better in the first picture. Maybe the hall continues the continuity of the design around the rest of the spaces.

Actually, you couldn't be more wrong in saying that I think they should be exclusive of each other, quiet the opposite, I think both factors should be thought of when creating good design. That doesn't mean that this can't be done well. Also, the halls might be designed this way (and decorated this way) to instinctively move the flow of traffic from one space to the next. So yes, I can see where the arguement can be made that this is a good design IDEA but because the idea is good, does that make how the idea was EXECUTED well? Honestly, I'm uncertain in this case. But I can be certain this site had lots of money and lots of space. Could the flow been better in certain spaces? Does the main lobby area look like its typically congested with foot traffic? Would there have been better ways to design these areas? Could a "certain level" of function have been lost when the same effects could have been achieved with slightly better planning or design. Perhaps saving money, construction costs, energy costs, etc.

So I believe its our job as designers to look at the big picture, to look at more than how does the place look and how the design concept is carried out. For me to suggest the space could have been designed better for functionality can be argued either way. Perhaps its perfect, perhaps its not. While this isn't my ideal "style" that doesn't mean this type of space and style can't be designed beautiful and well. It can be. But often designers in their zest to create dramatic halls, etc. in buildings of this style overlook elements that could make the building function better (like widening a hall by 2-3 feet, etc). In this case, could the flow of the building have been interupted thus creating a less than perfect experience in terms of function as well?

jedisalf

12-05-2006, 02:55

Thanks for the compliments.....actually it was kinda funny, my wife was looking at the art hanging and i was just looking at the building, only took a picture of me with a Mondrian, and of ocurse, my wife with a Dali.

About the building, i really love it, its soooooooooooooooooooooo simple, minimal and it gets the job done, yes its cold as someone points, but what japanese architecture isnt cold?....I really love Tadao Ando, but If i had the money i wouldnt get him to design a house for myself, i couldnt live in his spaces, will lost my mind, if you look at any JA (Japan Architect) magazine, you will notice this, their designs are functional, but theyre kinda souless......most of them atleast

Example: For this picture (http://www.pushpullbar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16848&stc=1&d=1147353355) would you say that there is much room during a typical week-end for a person in a wheelchair or a group of individuals touring together to walk down a hall and pause to look at pictures or art? For me it feels like a space where "traffic jams" of individuals will get stopped especially on the right side.

This hallway (http://www.pushpullbar.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=16850&stc=1&d=1147353427) may serve a function and perhaps may be there for more art... but if it's simply an empty hallway is it needed?

Ok, the first picture is the entrance to the basement, thats a PIXAR exposition right there, so it was packed with kids and adults, and the second picture youre refering to, is right above the first one, its just a hallway that takes you from one place to another (alongside the sculpture garden)

You gotta be aware of this MoMA floorplans, or the site, you enter it on 53 th street, next to the original Moma, then the building kinda stretches so it doenst mess with the old Moma, it kinda "embraces" it , and thats where this hallway is located, in the stretched part, cuz it has the original moma behind.

heres a PDF with the floor plans:
http://www.moma.org/visit_moma/documents/MoMA_ENG.pdf

About the square openeings in the facade, they do frame views of teh nearvy buildings, but you gotta be in there to check'them out, the museum has openeings everywhere so you can spot different views of manhattan, and when you walks around the garden, on diffrent levels thse openeings frame a diffrenet perspective of the nearby building, pretty cool for pictires actually, theres a cafe in the top floor terrace, it was closed, I bet there you get the best framed picture right next to this openings.

At the end its a museum, it just stores and exhibit art, and this one does it nice, you cant imagine how huge is inside, you pass gallery after gallery until you get lost....theres a lot of exhibition space inside, n matter how big i sthe art...actually when i was there there was even a helicopter hanging near the lobby, a real size one.....

I havent yet been inside the Bilbao Gugenheim, and im pretty sure it will take my breath away if i ever go there, but I preffer this cold tanaguchi over a ghery anytime, it has more respect for the surroundings.

On another subject, gonna try to post some pictures of an exhibition it took place in there about SAFETY.....but maybe in another thread.

Oh,...and in the architecture room, there was this house you cnat miss....I just forgot the arhcitects right now, but Ill try to post his info tomorrow...its just spectacular.

imasayer

12-05-2006, 17:53

First, I would appreciate the next time you criticize an idea from me or another that you wouldn't call that idea ignorant as I wouldn't do the same to you. But to get past that, just because no one suggested it wasn't functional doesn't mean that it is.

Brian,

I have replied to this here (http://www.pushpullbar.com/forums/showthread.php?p=44179#post44179). We were starting to take over this thread, so I continued our discussion elswhere.